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Season 10 Rules Changes - Discussion Stage
Posted by Allan Sellers on Monday, Jul. 24th, 2023 at 12:13 AM

I have 2 rules proposals.  If you have other ideas you can add them here too.  This is a total discussion thread.  I'm not saying we WILL do any of this or guaranteeing anything.  I'd like some some ideas and feedback to determine if we should move forward with them (and potentially discuss further to tweak).

EARLY BIRD ORDERS

As a commish I have to remind people about orders all the time before deadlines.   I don't love it, but its part of the job and that's fine.  

Would having an early bird deadline help people get something saved mid-week (like Wednesday at the Coaches Poll deadline; or could be Thursday/Friday too)?

Again, this helps me primarily but may also help you get a benefit for getting something put together early.

What's the reward?  You tell me.  One idea is 2 CP per session (so 24 CP over the course of a season, enough to improve a younger player in a skill twice in a season).  Or it could be an RP reward. 

You'd still be able to tinker.  I'd have to add a field to store the "first saved" (or inserted) date for lineups for a given session.  But that's easy enough to do.  Please share your ideas.

FAN INTIMIDATION NIGHT

Earlier this year I shared this "real life" scenario.  

At one of Max's matches away in Chicago there was an opposing player who clearly foot-faulted while serving (but the line judges aren't always paying attention frankly).  Mrs. Sellers wasn't paying attention either, but don't tell her I said that.

But I did tell her that THAT player just foot faulted.  She proceeded to (everytime he served for the rest of the match) basically scream at the referees:

WATCH HIS FEET!!!  HE'S A FOOT FAULTER!!!

True story.  Also, with the volume of (former high school cheerleader Mrs. Sellers) I normally sit far away from her to "take photos of the match".  

I shared that on the Blog I think.  Jason liked the idea and has helped me develop an initial proposal.  Here it goes.  As with the Early Bird one, please share ideas, pros/cons, tweaks, agree/disagree, etc.  

Approach:

1) Each team gets two "special" home games each season where they will have a MASSIVE fan base that impacts the match.  This is a regular conference match (not a conference tournament match or any other type of match).

2) Currently for home court the only difference is that the home team gets +1 for each player's SL in ATK, BLK, and DEF.  This addition would allow the home team to get the added benefit of their massive crowd harassing the away team when they serve.  So the away team's players would all get a -1 for their SRV SL in the match.  (again the Mrs. Sellers "he's a FOOT FAULTER" rule).  That's the only SL modifier.

3) Each team gets to type in a text box to "name" their special home match night.  Such as: Senior Day, Mrs. Sellers Day, Green out, Kiss of Death Night, Beat My Brother, Star Wars Night, etc. My one request here is that you keep the names reasonably clean and do not incorporate political/cultural issues into the names you use.  I trust your judgment on this, since it hasn't been an issue to date, but I reserve the right to ask you to change anything that crosses the line. Sorry, Mike. No "Halpin for Senate Night."  (though I'd buy a t-shirt)

4) Obviously, we'd probably need some code so that no team could use this against Quincy because that would be unfair.  😎

5) #4 is probably a joke.  But seriously I like the idea of selectively using it so the away team will feel like a victim (or I will remind them they are a victim) and get vengeance later.  🤓

6) We would likely do a "session 0" at the beginning of a season (or just make it part of session 1; where it takes effect for session 2+) where each team has to finalize their "FAN INTIMIDATION NIGHT" so it is published for the rest of the season.  Just like selecting a captain in the MSWL United leagues you'd get 1 chance to do it (or miss the chance/benefit).  

Readers Comments

I'm highly in favor of both of these ideas.

The early bird incentive would be enough for me to get my lineups in early (I'm hit or miss with getting them in before the weekend is over, or the following Friday. I see this as a good thing. A modest 2CP per session sounds reasonabnle to me. You don't want anything major.

For the Fan Intimidation night, I like the idea as written. My only concern is that I already feel that Home Court Advantage is TOO powerful. Of the 32 teams, there are only 3 teams that presently have a winning away record. There are 4 or 5 teams that have not won a single away match this season. If we implement this, I would recommend scaling back the standard home court bonus. 

(as an aside, I think this would be a good opportunity for BRBs in TMVL - Booster Club that allows a team to boost ONE attribute for their players - ATK, BLK, DEF twice per session, or 2 attributes once per session... just a thought)

Rob Peterson on Monday, Jul. 24th, 2023 at 12:44 AM
 

I'm opposed to both of these rules. 
 

An early bird deadline would create mid-week stress for and that's a burden I don't want or need. I love the Sunday deadline because the weekend is usually flexible enough that I have no trouble hitting that. But an early bird deadline just becomes an earlier deadline that I wouldn't want to miss but would be less convenient it make. I suppose I could throw whatever lineups out there early to gain points and amend them later, but that doesn't seem like the purpose behind the rule. I also don't enjoy, and this is just me, sitting around all week waiting for results for lineups previously sent.

I don't support the second rule because it is what I refer to as a squirrel rule. It's unpredictable, and for as much apparent planning that goes into the game and weekly lineups, it seems counterintuitive to that purpose.

everyone can hate on me now.

 

 

Phil McIntosh on Monday, Jul. 24th, 2023 at 5:10 AM
 

Sorry for the grammatical errors. Waiting on a new kangaroo.

Phil McIntosh on Monday, Jul. 24th, 2023 at 5:12 AM
 

*keyboard*

Phil McIntosh on Monday, Jul. 24th, 2023 at 5:12 AM
 

I had the same thought as Rob about fan intimidation - love the idea but far from convinced that home teams need any more advantages.  Given that the real life example happened at an away game, how about keeping the idea but making it something that the travelling support can do? You could keep the naming convention but it would just be the Beat My Brother Road Trip rather than BMB Night.

Roger Mendonça on Monday, Jul. 24th, 2023 at 6:15 AM
 

I like the idea of making the second proposed rule change possible to use on the road aswell as at home. It might help give teams more chance to get an away win which are more difficult to achieve. Maybe limit te intimidation to be used only in conference games. Might make it more acceptable to Phil?

I normally put my orders in after watching the weeks matches, just so I have something in place just in case I forget later in the week, so the early bird rule suits me down to the ground! However I can understand that for some they prefer to put their orders in closer to the game.

Vick Hall on Monday, Jul. 24th, 2023 at 11:49 AM
 

The early bird works (maybe Friday) - as long as it's just a minor RP bonus (5-10). It lowers Al's tension and doesn't change any mechanics.

The home bonus XXL improves the already very strong bonus even more; not too attractive IMHO.

The away bonus would work (as HB counter), but the "great big fan bus tour" somewhat stretches credibility too much.

So basically, I'd prefer no changes.

Eduard Habermann on Monday, Jul. 24th, 2023 at 4:59 PM
 

See I don't think home bonus is all that much even though the stats say otherwise. It feels more psychological to me 

In Game summary there's a table that shows each side's average player skill rating. Home bonus accounts for 3.6 of this. Yes this is an advantage but not overwhelming  

Another way to look at it is to consider each skill  

Increasing ATK by 1 gives only about 0.5% increase in the attacker's chance of getting an excellent attack. It also only gives a 1% increase in the attack being in. An excellent attack with a high ATK player is 100% anyway. I don't know the odds on defensive digs 

Increasing BLK will only affect single blocks if the home bonus increases BLK to 20. For 2 man blocks it will increase the block chance by 1 or 2% and for 3 man by 2 or 3%. In my game with the Scarecrows there were about 100 points apiece. Let's say average BLK was 15: this gives a 24% chance of a 2 man block and with home bonus this goes up to 25% There's not likely to be 100 block chances due to serve errors, serve aces and attackers hitting out but if th

ere was then block advantage would only give the  Scarecrows 1 or 2 extra blocks.

So yes, an advantage but not overwhelming. But you see those ticks and decide you can't win.

Steve Turner on Monday, Jul. 24th, 2023 at 6:35 PM
 

Here's how I would rework both things:

I would re-work home court completely whereas for every home game, you get to pick up to three players to boost their ATK, BLK and DEF as opposed to the default six. Allow two marketing nights a year for league opponents only - announced at the start of the year - where all six players get the bonus. HOWEVER, every time a team gets picked for a marketing game, they get say +10 RP immediately, since recruits will want to come to play for those teams.

I don't like the idea of an early bird bonus but I also NMR'd a lot one MSWL season after I got busy at work and the automated reminder emails either stopped or went to spam.

John Holden on Tuesday, Jul. 25th, 2023 at 11:08 AM
 

Steve also understands how this game works better than I do, but it's also a game where a small skill advantage can make a big overall difference over time.

John Holden on Tuesday, Jul. 25th, 2023 at 11:09 AM
 

At the moment most weeks I don't get orders in until Friday afternoon as that's my no one else around for a couple of hours time. So probably wouldn't use the early bird.

 

Not sure how I feel about the home or away advantage idea.  For teams like myself who aren't great to start with,  giving stronger teams more of an advantage doesn't seem right. Unless I've misunderstood the whole thing. 

Matthew Fowler on Wednesday, Jul. 26th, 2023 at 2:13 AM
 

I didn't comment on the early bird option as I tend to put my orders in straight after reading my results (that way I don't have to worry about strategy or thinking) so I don't think I'm the target audience for the question.  I would say, though, that 24 CPs a season feels a bit too significant (at least for a team like Pekin that probably only earns 30-40 from sets won per season). So, if we go down that route, I'd suggest maybe use RPs instead - possibly 5 rather than 2?

Roger Mendonça on Wednesday, Jul. 26th, 2023 at 4:41 PM
 

I like the idea of fan intimidation nights but don't really have a helpful comment on how it should work. But do like John's idea about RP's going to the team that gets picked.

I think RPs (agree with Roger and others who think CP may be a bit much) for early bird is a good idea. Anything to make Al's job easier is good in my book. I do wonder, did adding RP rewards to Coaches Poll increase participation? I think I'm remembering correctly that we originally didn't have that.

Bryce Kalmbach on Wednesday, Jul. 26th, 2023 at 5:58 PM
 

I am happy to go with the early bird orders idea, if it makes Al's like easier.  But I don't the like fan intimidation night idea....it seems to be deliberately bringing nastiness into the game and I don't see that as a positive thing.

Paul Cockayne on Thursday, Aug. 3rd, 2023 at 7:59 PM